Butthurt Street

**sumbich** · 12-17-2015

THE (correct) STATEMENT WAS JUST IN A VIDEO I POSTED, not only that, I had reiterated it after the fact.

THANK YOU FOR MAKING MY POINT FOR ME. You're not interested in debating a goddamned anything, you're simply looking for a way to dismiss my arguments in their entirety.

Like I said, transparent as all hell - all you're looking for is that neat "oh, here's your problem, now I can dismiss everything you've said." All I had to do was tell you what you wanted to hear!

and you're here trying to say you'd rather NOT argue semantics. unranus, ALL you want to do is argue semantics, because apparently that's the only ground you feel comfortable on.

your non-argument's been on the stove too long already

**uranus** · 12-17-2015

I'm sorry for angering you, sensei. Please enlighten me. I have a learning disability. Please, could you write out the correct statement so that we may all see the errors in our thinking?

**sumbich** · 12-17-2015

as I've asserted from the beginning, I'm not interested in playing gotcha word games, which appears to be just about all you're capable of or interested in. even when the thread has tried to actually get on with it, you're sitting here dragging it back to word games over and over. if you want to play word games let's at least do it with events that are being discussed....by the rest of the participants.

if you were confident in your position, you would not have this problem. since you have an attachment to being right, you're not stepping where you're not footsure.

that takes balls eh

**uranus** · 12-17-2015

Originally Posted by sumbich

you have an attachment to being right

Thank you, sensei. I have learned that every time I ask a question I must suffer pages of your divine wrath before you are willing to answer my one simple question. I humbly await your true wisdom.

Originally Posted by uranus

Please, could you write out the correct statement so that we may all see the errors in our thinking?

**TimTim** · 12-17-2015

Originally Posted by sumbich

as I've asserted from the beginning, I'm not interested in playing gotcha word games, which appears to be just about all you're capable of or interested in. even when the thread has tried to actually get on with it, you're sitting here dragging it back to word games over and over. if you want to play word games let's at least do it with events that are being discussed....by the rest of the participants.

But it isn't word games. It's simple logic. Logic is 100% required to come to a proven, truthful conclusion.

It seems that every time there's a conflict between news reports (prone to human error) and evidence (also prone to human error), you jump to the conclusion that there is a conspiracy behind it. You cannot reasonably (i.e., logically) jump to this conclusion, no matter how often there are conflicts between news reports and evidence. Could there be some kind of conspiracy? Sure. But without enough evidence (i.e., logically truthful premises) to prove said conspiracies, no one but the conspirators themselves can be 100% certain that there is in fact a conspiracy, so acting as if you're 100% certain makes you look like a fool.

**sumbich** · 12-17-2015

Originally Posted by TimTim

But it isn't word games. It's simple logic. Logic is 100% required to come to a proven, truthful conclusion.

It seems that every time there's a conflict between news reports (prone to human error) and evidence (also prone to human error), you jump to the conclusion that there is a conspiracy behind it. You cannot reasonably (i.e., logically) jump to this conclusion, no matter how often there are conflicts between news reports and evidence. Could there be some kind of conspiracy? Sure. But without enough evidence (i.e., logically truthful premises) to prove said conspiracies, no one but the conspirators themselves can be 100% certain that there is in fact a conspiracy, so acting as if you're 100% certain makes you look like a fool.

Which is why I keep using 911 as an example, because there are provable lies, logical inconsistencies and completely irrational conclusions presented by the commission report.

I am 100% certain that the Official 911 report contains falsehoods. The assertions put forth do not pass the fundamentals of physics test, so before one even gets into the logical aspects of argumentation, one already knows the conclusions are false - so to the extent that the commission report attempted to put together some sort of coherent argument, it doesnt even meet the standard of actually matching physical reality. In fact anyone not certain the 911 commission report contains misdirection is either 1)financially or ad vitam dependent on the story in some fashion, 2) outlined in the alief, argumentum ad vericundiam, and argumentum ad populum vids.

There's a different matter between simple human error, the rush to get a story out, getting certain things completely wrong - and having your editor dictated to as to how it all went down.

In the San Bernadino shooting, many eyewitness accounts are completely different than what the news reports say happened. The official story once again doesnt add up. The matter of Mrs being found in a belly shirt and tight pants does not jive with the prudish jihadist meme; the matter of them being found face down and handcuffed in the back of the vehicle, with all the windows shot out yet still rolled up does not jive with the meme of them shooting at police; the approach from the rear of the vehicle does not jive with the windshield being fully shot up with holes. I have never in all my life seen the media let into someone's home to pick through their stuff in a case like this. If they were hellbent on attack, and had made pipe bombs, what the hell sense does it make to leave the pipe bombs at home while out doing your attack? The guy was posting to facebook while the attack was happening? lolworthy, the entire charade, except for that fact that false flag terrorism utterly sucks.

Please tell me more about how the news story here is not shot full of holes...

This very significant uptick in mass shootings is just happenstance? If anyone thinks this is normal, they need a head check.

"Beyond a reasonable doubt" is used in courtrooms for a reason. Did the news reports actually establish beyond a reasonable doubt that man and woman did this? Only if you ignore all of the contrary evidence on the ground. Is ignoring contrary evidence somehow logical? What I appear to be getting from some here is that news stories are automatically prima facie with nothing further than the story itself, and now I must build a logical argument with those givens taken as fact? ho ho ho, I dont think so. Even through the inconsistencies I mentioned above...you're harping on me about presenting a logical argument, when this is the data I am given to parse? LOL...if you guys were *that* interested in logic, you'd be responding to the red flashing light in your head and doing some logical deduction.....in more than one direction.

**uranus** · 12-17-2015

Thank you, sensei. I look forward to the day that we can all grasp the concepts outlined in your learned treatises. As you have frequently pointed out, most of us (99.9999%?) are barren of the advanced mental powers that you take for granted. I (we?) do not posess the brain function to hold all this advanced theory in our brains and then make sense of it all. I humbly request that you choose one scenario so that we may examine each point in detail using the logic for which we all now have an elevated appreciation and common reference through your generous and learned gathering of youtube videos.

I hope you will tolerate my impudence once more by allowing me to suggest a starting point.

Originally Posted by sumbich

I am 100% certain that the Official 911 report contains falsehoods.

I hope you will also honor my request that you outline these points in a simple and clear manner without the profuse rhetoric and ad hominem attacks that we so admittedly deserve. My (our) brain is not prepared enough yet to wade through all this higher plane inofrmation without becoming very confused.

p.s. I'm sorry you burned your eggs this morning. That must be very frustrating. Have you ever tried using your gung to control the stove or even cook eggs without a stove? Is that a possibility?

Originally Posted by sumbich

**TimTim** · 12-17-2015

Originally Posted by sumbich

Please tell me more about how the news story here is not shot full of holes...

Once again, just because the news story got some things wrong does not mean it's a false flag conspiracy. Please tell me you understand the logical disconnect between your premise(s) and your conclusion here. Think about it. You simply cannot reasonably come to the conclusion that it's all a false flag operation based on the fact that news/commission reports were inaccurate. That requires a significant leap in logic.

Originally Posted by sumbich

This very significant uptick in mass shootings is just happenstance? If anyone thinks this is normal, they need a head check.

It probably has something to do with the IS spreading, wars in the middle east, and subsequently placing blame on western (i.e., modern) civilization, which may or may not be well-placed but let's be real here, the blame can be spread across many countries. And I agree with you on the last part, it requires a very disturbed and brainwashed individual to think murdering innocent civilians for any reason is normal.

--- Updated ---

Originally Posted by sumbich

Is ignoring contrary evidence somehow logical?

No one is ignoring contrary evidence. I'll reiterate one more time: Contrary evidence to a story does not imply a false flag operation. The only evidence that will indicate a conspiracy is evidence that actually indicates a conspiracy.

**sumbich** · 12-17-2015

Originally Posted by TimTim

Once again, just because the news story got some things wrong does not mean it's a false flag conspiracy. Please tell me you understand the logical disconnect between your premise(s) and your conclusion here. Think about it. You simply cannot reasonably come to the conclusion that it's all a false flag operation based on the fact that news/commission reports were inaccurate. That requires a significant leap in logic.

It probably has something to do with the IS spreading, wars in the middle east, and subsequently placing blame on western (i.e., modern) civilization, which may or may not be well-placed but let's be real here, the blame can be spread across many countries. And I agree with you on the last part, it requires a very disturbed and brainwashed individual to think murdering innocent civilians for any reason is normal.

--- Updated ---

No one is ignoring contrary evidence. I'll reiterate one more time: Contrary evidence to a story does not imply a false flag operation. The only evidence that will indicate a conspiracy is evidence that actually indicates a conspiracy.

So basically you're telling me that until someone who's part of the conspiracy comes forward and admits there was a conspiracy, it will forever be logically unprovable? Hell of a way to find those conspiracies out! Hey, let me ask you, do you think the long line of guns, drugs, corruption and dead bodies behind the Clintons is just some vast right wing conspiracy too?

The news did not just get it wrong, an entirely different narrative was created. Do you even ask the question why? Or what they add up to? Is it even registering that this is beyond "just getting a couple details wrong?"

Why is it that 3 men dressed up in swat gear and khakis were reported doing this? The muslim guy wasnt even wearing khakis. Add in all of the other stuff I mentioned, and this is called ignoring discrepancies. If you still believe the news after seeing all of these discrepancies, I contend alief impacts you much moreso than you think.

What does this add up to, in your mind? Believing in what the news reported, when it diverges so strongly from eyewitness accounts, and not yourself requiring a higher standard is somewhat hypocritical. What conclusion can you come to, when we immediately see the politicians getting on the airwaves talking about more "common sense gun laws"....people start talking about it every time we're subjected to one of these operations (as if laws on the books, correctly enforced, arent sufficient.) What, you dont think the next Patriot Act is not already written and waiting until there's enough mass shootings for them to cram it through the law books?

do you realize the implications of the 17th amendment, in light of things like this?

We've had our money stolen and replaced with worthless currency that's being printed at an ever increasing rate. We've had our government subverted and broken. We have "legislators" that dont actually legislate and will pass clearly unconstitutional measures. (or do you think obamacare, or the patriot act, or medicare part D, the Federal Reserve, the 17th amendment, or even *gasp* SOCIAL SECURITY are even remotely constitutional in the least? Anyone that contends so does not understand the limits that were placed upon the federal government. or how's about the tossing aside of constitutionally declared war powers, those being almost entirely in the executive these days? Bet you didnt know that the Post Office is not the original post office and is actually under the operations of the executive branch!)

Once is a tragedy, twice might be a copycat, thrice might be enemy action,

but this?

while correlation isnt always causation...

how's them open borders doing again? Why is it that we just cant seem to control that? Who's in charge or customs? DHS. Who's in charge of DHS? Yes, that falls under the Executive branch.

how's them "training exercises" doing again? but of course let's not mention the correlation to training events and terris' attacks. even though the correlation just. keeps. showing. up. for all these events. nah, that's not worth looking into or mentioning.

The entirety of the 20th and 21st century wars are established upon lies. Banking fuckery and subversion of countries. (do I have to dig up articles on that too? there's plenty.)

WHY does this happen? Because our country is subverted and has been taken over from within, bought off and paid for - at this point its relatively self sustaining, this cancer.

Y'all probably believe the kid in sandy hook used an ar-15 too. Despite it being invented out of thin air live on the air, with the Lt vacillating about what the shotgun was before the barrage of questions about was it an assault rifle gave way to yes it was an assault rifle. The initial on air testimony was that the kid used 2 handguns to do the job and had a shotgun in his trunk. Cui bono, the invention of the AR-15 and subsequent legislation in CT requiring us all to register our ARs?

Nevermind, dont ask these things, just reach CNN and nevermind Cooper's roots. Apparently its too big of a puzzle, like those crazy 5000 piece ones you never finish.

At root it all gets down to money, and the fact that yes, like the quote from netanyahu years ago, the US will be left as a bloated broke welfare state (that can dry up and blow away once we're done with them. but hey, pointing it out is anti semitic, right? even though the sonovabitch is no semite.)

If your world is only black or white, all cut and dry, you're never going to get the answers to life's puzzles, mysteries, and fuckeries.

**uranus** · 12-17-2015

preach it, sensei. amen.

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